DAVID ESLICK: The mom and pop, the corner store, even after the '50s, was a place to visit, the place to get together.

[music playing] DALE MOORE: Food has often been referred to as the great equalizer.

We all need it and consume it regularly, at least, I do.

But when you stop to think about how and where your groceries come from, you may realize there's lots of hands and shelves in between you and your plate full of food.

On this "OzarksWatch," we'll visit with a longtime meat cutter, David Eslick, whose career has spanned many different grocery stores in Springfield and the Ozarks region.

We'll talk about how grocery stores have transitioned from the mom and pop corner stores to megamarts and what that means in our communities.

Stay tuned.

NARRATOR: Ozarks Public Television and Missouri State University are proud to present "OzarksWatch Video Magazine," a locally produced program committed to increasing the understanding of the richness and complexity of Ozarks culture.

Visit our website for more information.

You we take a lot of things for granted in life.

That doesn't make us a bad person.

That makes us human.

One of the things we probably take for granted more often times than not is the food that sits on your table, and how it gets there, and where it comes from.

And as you know, that's quite a long story.

Hi, I'm Dale Moore.

Welcome to the "OzarksWatch Video Magazine."

And my guest today is David Eslick, and David is all things grocery stores.

David, it is so good to have you on the show.

It is great to be here.

I said, I love this program, and I love you guys.

Well, we're tickled you're here.

I've known you for a lot of years, and you're kind of like me.

You've done a little bit of everything and dabbled.

You've been a photographer.

You've been in the grocery business for-- All my life.

--all of your life.

All my life, yeah.

Give us a snapshot of you in the grocery business.

Well, I started in the grocery business in 1956.

Consumers had built their fifth store, and I went up and knocked on the door.

And Clarence Wheeler-- or Austin Wheeler, Clarence's dad-- I was one of the last guys he hired in 1956.

And I went to work over at Consumers Number Four on Bennett and Glenstone.

And it's interesting.

I started to work there, and then, when Bill Smiley bought that store in 2012, I was working for him when it closed.

So I said, the time in between there and then, but I went into the meat department in 1959 and have been a meat cutter ever since.

Butcher works and packing house, meat cutter works in the grocery store.

All Right, so that was your first job really was groceries.

Yeah, I swept the floor at a place over on Brentwood, but that was my first real job, yeah.

What made you want to get a job in the grocery business?

Well, you know, I don't know.

It was something that-- one of the things-- let's back up a little bit.

The grocery stores in 1950, and this is an interesting bit of trivia that a lot of our listeners don't know.

In 1950, there were 245 grocery stores in Springfield.

The population was 66,000.

Wow.

The city limits was way smaller than it is now, and they were mom and pop stores.

They were neighborhood stores on the corner, and there weren't any big, big grocery stores.

Ramey started actually in 1939, but they didn't start building their supermarkets, until the '50s.

Consumers opened their first supermarket in 1951, so the grocery business was where a person, a kid after school or summertime could get a job.

And they paid, like, $0.40 an hour, you know?

But it was a good job, and I am of that age.

And you are, too, where work ethics was important.

My mom, when I started sweeping floors at that place, she said, now, you be the best floor sweeper they've ever seen.

So that work ethic has continued through my years, but the grocery business was, like I said, a place a kid could get a job.

And then, as I got into it and stayed with it, I learned a lot of stuff from store managers and what have you, how to treat people, customer service.

A lot of people remember Consumer's and Ramey's, because they were the first superstores.

We had Kroger's and Safeway.

Right.

But customer service was what their thing was.

When I started at four o'clock in the afternoon at that store and every store they had, there was 20 carryout boys lined up at the front window.

And as the people come through those check stands, there was one or two carryout boys filling up filling up those sacks, and it was customer service.

And you didn't hand a person a sack.

You carried it to their car, and some of my best relationships to this day are people that I had met carrying out their groceries.

I don't doubt that a bit.

In 1956, my grocery store, I lived in the country West of Mount Vernon.

Our grocery store was behind us in a root cellar.

Yeah.

We canned everything.

We gathered everything.

We cut our own meat.

We butchered our own hogs, and I remember that, when you went to the grocery store then, we called it trading.

We're going to go in.

We traded with somebody.

In Mount Vernon on the square, just off the square, there was a grocery store called Hunter's, Hadley Hunter, and it was him and his wife.

And they ran the entire story.

It was a mom and pop.

Right.

It was a mom and pop.

Right, You know, there was a real farm to table thing that happened, farm to sort of table back in those days in the mom and pops.

Yeah, so you talked about dry goods.

I mean, dry goods meant dry goods.

Yeah, the grocery stores, like you say, you canned and had a cow, or there was dairy delivery.

Highland Dairy, their old delivery truck would still bring it to different things.

So when you went to the store, you didn't go fill up a cart.

You went up there, and you got flour.

And you got sugar.

You got coffee, and you got the staples.

And the rest of that stuff you had you at home, and then the grocery store, the canned goods they had.

You know, people would can stuff, but there were certain things that they couldn't raise and can themselves.

So those items were in the grocery store, and the thing about the grocery stores back then, the owners kept that in that grocery store what their customers wanted.

And if somebody needed something different, they'd try to find it, but you know, times were simpler back then.

And I've got some pictures of some grocery ads with the prices, you know?

A $0.19 on one of the things, $0.19 beef liver was a big thing, you know?

But the old grocery stores back then were-- they were neighborhood stores, you know?

Oh yeah.

And when you went to your neighborhood store, your meat cutter or your butcher, as they called them, they would take care of u over a service counter, a little six foot service counter that had way a lot fewer cuts and stuff than we have today.

But that was your communication.

They'd come in, and visit with you, and tell you something, and something about what was going on in the neighborhood.

Then the next person come in, so your contact with your customers, you know?

And they look forward to coming to the store and visiting with the people in the store.

Most of small towns in Southwest Missouri were set up, like this.

You had the post office.

You had the grocery store, and you had the MFA.

You had to feed mills.

So you'd come into town.

You'd get your feed.

You'd go to the post office, buy stamps or whatever, and then you'd had over for a stop at the grocery store.

And a lot of times, these stores had potbelly stoves, and the old timers would sit-in there.

I call them the spittin' wheeler club, and they would visit with what was going on.

So the mom and pop, the corner store, even after the '50s, was a place to visit, a place to get together.

It was family.

I mean, going into the grocery store was-- of course, you went to church with him.

You saw him at conventions and gatherings.

I did, yeah.

And they were the-- that's what you did, right, is go to the grocery store?

So the grocery business, I've always heard that it's hard to make money in the grocery business.

It is.

That it's a tight margin.

It's a 1%-- it's a penny market, a penny market.

I went to SMS for a little bit before I decided to get into the grocery business full-time, and one of my professors-- and I don't remember now what.

It might have been a business course.

But he said, OK, my business only makes 1%.

Would you like to be in that business?

And, of course, everybody said, well, no.

Well, he raised up his window blind there, and it was a grocery business.

And this guy was doing a million dollars a year.

Now, would you like to have 1% of a million dollars?

Well, sure, you know?

And the thing that drives that, I think, is competition.

Springfield at one time in the '60s-- I was at a meat seminar.

And the fella traveled all over the United States, and he said, Springfield is the most competitive grocery market in the country.

Because Smitty's, Dillon's, Consumer's, Ramey's, Solo's, they all wanted a piece of that dollar.

Right, And they drove those ads with prices to get you in their store.

Right, And it's still that way, you know?

One of the things talking back about mom and pop stores, when I went to work for Walter Blunt in 1970, there were stores on every corner, and I said, Walter, what's the deal with that?

And he had been in that store since probably 1950, and before it was a solo, it was a superette.

And then it was part of a quick check group and then solo.

He said, well, when guys come back from the war, there weren't any jobs, and they could go to Springfield Grocery Company or associated grocers and buy their groceries, buy some groceries on time, and bring them home, sell them out of their garage.

Of course, they didn't have garages back then, because they didn't have cars out of their front room.

Or if there was a building close by, they could do that, and they would have a grocery store.

Plus they'd have a little bit of money, and back then, $40 a week was a wage that would pay everything.

So that's how-- and they ended up on every corner.

Then when they sold the groceries, they went and paid for those and got some more.

And that's how the mom and pops operated, and then you come into the super center or the supermarkets with Consumer's, and Ramey's, and those guys.

I remember, when I was a kid, my grandmother would send me to the store.

She'd send me out.

Go to the store, and Hadley's going to have some things for you there.

And we'd put it on-- we'd just put it on her tab.

Put it on a tab.

And you'd put it on tab, and at the end of the month or whenever, or if you can't, we'll catch you in a couple of weeks.

That's right.

Can you imagine doing that now, walking into-- That's right.

Just put it on my tab.

I've got some tabs, some tickets from my mom in 1946.

They were, like, $11 and $3 dollars.

And like you say, I could go get that, and they'd sell it to me.

They'd watch it, but I didn't get much penny candy.

Because that wasn't on the list, you know?

And the strange thing about that, I think, is that, for the most part, people had integrity, and they paid those bills.

It may take-- you know, they may have to pay a little bit more each month.

But as a rule, they ended up paying those bills, so that guy didn't mind giving them credit.

Yeah, you mentioned people coming back from the war, and how do you think the war, World War I, World War II, even Vietnam, Korea, how do they affect the grocery business or impact it?

Well, you know, it's an interesting question.

When those guys came back from the war, especially early on, the economy was not good.

I mean, it was after a war, and you had all kinds of things.

And the grocery store, there, again, that was where they could go, and they could get what they needed.

And then the grocery business provided jobs.

I mean, in the later war, later years, there was delivery jobs, milk, bread, groceries delivery job, stockers and meat cutters, you know?

When I started, they were training meat cutters.

I started out as a wrapper, and as an apprentice, and then I got my journeyman qualification.

So these were opportunities for jobs after the war, you know?

And veterans deserve that, you know?

That's something-- I'm not a veteran.

But they deserve something, like that, where they're treated-- Yeah, you know, you mentioned what a big business here in Southwest Missouri the food business is.

You know, I think of the dairy business alone, you've got all, you know, Kraft.

You've got-- at Mount Vernon, we had Carnation.

Over at Lockwood, there was a PET, PET Milk Company, and we sold milk.

It'd get processed and wind up at the grocery store.

Right.

I remember, when I worked at KTTS, years ago, downtown in out studio area there, we shared offices with the Ozark Grocers Association.

That's right.

That's right.

What exactly did that association-- what'd they do?

Those guys, and it's interesting.

I've gotten a lot of pictures that those guys had, and George Dillard was the director of that for forever.

And they kind of tied these stores, the community stores.

It was the Ozarks.

It wasn't in Springfield, and they had meetings.

And they had a convention, and these guys were competitors.

But they were friendly towards each other, and the Grocers Association kind of cemented that relationship with these stores.

And it's still going.

It's still up.

And what kind of support did they provide the grocery store folks?

Is it distribution channel or-- No, I think more than anything else, it was just relationships with the suppliers.

You know, they weren't distributors, and they weren't salespeople.

They were kind of a conduit for between the businesses and the suppliers.

And, of course, you go out on, what, East Division?

And you've got Associated-- Associated Wholesale Grocers, I worked for them for a little bit.

Talk about that organization.

They are huge.

They are the largest wholesale food distributor in the United States that distributes to independently owned supermarkets and grocery stores.

There are 4,000 locations.

There's eight distributors.

There's eight warehouses, like we have here in Springfield, and their sales are $10 billion with a B dollars.

And that little store, that little warehouse out there, when I worked with them in the '90s, that was the second operation they had.

And now, they cover the United States, and they do a tremendous job.

You know, right now, with COVID and everything, we go to the store, and there's a lot of stuff, where we can't get it.

I mean, I have never-- I retired in 2005 and have worked for different people.

And I'm now-- Retired again.

Yeah, retired again.

I now work for Price Cutter, and I have never had a grocery meat case that had holes in it.

I mean, there was something to put in that hole.

Well, now, they leave that hole.

So if they go out there to order, they know that something goes in that hole, and the distribution, the opportunity to get product is so hard.

We just come through with school starting.

We could not get Lunchables for the school kids.

Now, it started, where they've started getting them now, you know?

So the Associated Grocers with their cloud that they have, you think, well, they can get anything they want.

But if it's not there to bring to them, they don't get it.

So when you look at Associated Wholesale Grocers, it's enormous.

I can't imagine how big that place is.

I've always wanted to go in there.

I mean, do they have literally everything grocery related, including meat, or is it just dry goods?

No, they've got a meat department.

They've got a freezer that-- you know, it's amazing.

And it's 40 below 0 in there.

I was a meat quality control supervisor, but they have everything.

And they have some health and beauty aids or warehouses across the United States too.

So you can literally get everything you need for your store out of that Associated Grocers.

Yeah, I'm sure there's a connection, too, with Springfield Underground for storage.

Right.

Kraft is out There.

You see a truck going back and forth from Kraft all the time.

And I guess from there, it gets distributed out of the underground storage.

It comes from there to the warehouse to AG, and going back, too, to the mom and pop stores and the suppliers that they had.

Springfield Grocer Company is the oldest company in Springfield, and they were one of the first ones that serviced mom and pop stores, you know?

And then Springfield Grocer Ozark Grocer was over on commercial.

Street.

It took care of Ralph Brown, and the North side stores.

And, of course, those things are gone now.

Springfield Grocer is geared kind of out to the restaurant business, and they still have, I'm sure, some food stores.

You know, you go to any store, and what you see on the shelf, you'll see name brands.

But then I'm always intrigued.

You'll see best choice, and always save, and these, I guess, they're for lack of a better term generic brands, how do they come into being?

Those are brands that AG warehouse has, Springfield Grocer Company, and we can remember back Yellow Bonnet, the Yellow Bonnet girl.

Down on Water Street, there's a tower with the Yellow Bonnet.

That was their brand.

Best Choice and Always Save is an AG brand.

Walmart has their brand.

Dillon's has their brand.

Hy-Vee has their brand, and that was a way to sell something at a lesser price than the name brands.

But the quality on those are as good as the name brands.

I mean, they have to go through specifications, and the same thing with the meat companies, MFA Packing Company.

Go bond products, that was their brand.

The Duke Packing Company, Welch Packing Company, Ozark, or Go Bond, Go Bond was a brand.

So that is an item that they can sell at a lesser price, and like you say, for their lost leader.

But it's a quality item.

And a can of corn is a can of corn.

Yeah, well, my wife would disagree with you on that.

Yeah, you know, we're coming into a new era now, and now, you can literally order groceries and have them delivered to your front door.

What are some of the big changes that are happening in the grocery store business?

And it's really funny.

In fact, when Bill Smiley's store was going and I worked there, they started kind of an online thing and grocery orders coming in there online.

And Bill Smiley's mom would be the grocery order filter for that, and today, one of the things with COVID, people not getting out, online ordering.

Again, there was people that that's all they do is pick up orders in these stores, so that's a change that's come about in the grocery business.

You know, I've been in it long enough.

I've seen the thing from the meat wrapped in white paper to cellophane wrapped plastic trays, and now, vacuum wrapped, vacuum seal stuff.

But the online shopping and the delivery service, of course, mom and pop stores had delivery service, you know?

And that's where, like I say, some of these kids that worked after school, that was what they did.

They delivered, but that's probably the biggest thing that the grocery business is the technology of the online orders, and even the orders to AG are now done online.

You know, they're all digital electronic, but customer service is still what drives the grocery business.

If you don't have good customer service, meat cutters, you know, I'm the last of a dying breed.

I've been doing this for 62 years.

There's not anybody around as old as me that's still cutting meat.

That may not be good, but there's not any young people coming up to learn that trade.

I wonder why that is.

Yeah.

I wonder why.

I don't know.

I don't know.

You know, it's a fun business.

You know, I'm one of these guys.

You either love the business.

You love the grocery business, or you hate it.

And I'm one of these guys that love it.

I used to go in.

I used to float in all the Price Cutter stores, and I'd go in and say, I love my job.

Well, one of the store managers, I see him every once in a while.

He'd say, Eslick, you still love your job?

I said, well, sure, sure, but I don't know why young people don't want to do that.

It's a great job.

You know, unions have great retirement.

The companies anymore, most of your companies are employee owned.

Price Cutter, Hy-Vee and those guys, you work, and you pay something to yourself when you're working.

You know, you do a good job.

I've always said, never trust a skinny butcher or a skinny cook.

That's right.

They're not trustworthy.

You know, as you look at the-- and it's almost like a, as they say, a kind of a dichotomy.

On the one hand, you got people that are wanting stuff delivered to their front door.

But on the other hand, you've got stores that continue to talk about shop local, be local, and try and be a local kind of a business.

Mom and pops always did that.

Their suppliers were local.

And back in the day, when you was talking about getting a ticket, they would buy local produce.

A lot of times, they'd buy local chickens.

Walter Blunt told me one time that used to at Thanksgiving, they had to dress their own turkeys.

I said, well, I'm glad I don't live in that here.

But these things in these mom and pop stores were always local, you know?

And really, I think, until the big chains started coming in, even consumers and Ramey's still, over the years, they bought local produce, you know?

And back in the day, that would be part of the barter.

You know, they'd come in and buy flour and sugar, and they'd trade bacon or something that they had in excess, right?

Well, I think, too, and I don't mean this way this is going to sound.

But the health craze has kind of affected the way people-- It has.

--buy food, you know?

Right.

And I could drop a pound or two, and it wouldn't hurt anything.

But boy, I sure do like a big old ribeye.

You bet, yeah.

I do.

And you know, that's another thing.

The stores, and even the little stores had the health department come around and make sure that their stores were up to snuff, and certainly, the meat shops.

You know, I've got two or three pictures of meat shops that's kind of neat to see what was behind that counter.

You know, as a society and as a culture, we could probably do away with a lot of things, but a grocery store is not one of them.

It is not.

You know, you need that.

You need to-- they're, again, if nothing else, just to go visit with people, you know?

And the supermarkets today, most of them have one of the prettiest produce counters, or meat counters, or even the stores.

They dress them up.

They have the nice, big displays, and they're proud of their product.

They're proud of their company.

Well, David Eslick, as always, it's a treat to talk to you.

You too.

Thanks for giving us a trip through the grocery store.

I'm hungry now.

I've got to get some bread and milk.

I'm almost sure of it.

I hope this brings back some memories for some people.

It does.

Thanks for being with us.

Thank you, Dale.

You stay tuned.

I'll be right back.

NARRATOR: Ozarks Public Television and Missouri State University are proud to present OzarksWatch Video Magazine, a locally produced program committed to increasing the understanding of the richness and complexity of Ozarks culture.

Visit our website for more information.

Well, I don't know about you, but I'm headed to the store.

And I'm going to grab a cart full of groceries, because I'm hungry.

Thanks to my guest, David Eslick, for showing what it takes to bring home the bacon as they say.

Join us, again, soon for another OzarksWatch Video Magazine.

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