MICHAEL COCHRAN: When you're writing under contract and you have deadlines, you have to say no to almost everything.

People want you to come to the barbecue-- DALE MOORE: Yeah.

--or do this or that, you just can't do it, not if you're serious about finishing your work.

[music playing] From the beginning of KWTO and the Ozark Jubilee in the early 20th century, to the rise of the Ozark Mountain Daredevils in the 1970s and '80s, the Ozarks has long been known as a hub of musical talent.

Our guest today is Michael Cochran, a local musician, writer, promoter, and radio announcer, who's been a familiar voice on radio and television for decades.

Throughout his long career, he has played alongside many famous musicians and has written biographies on the legendary Chet Atkins, Les Paul, and Don McLean.

Today, we'll talk about some of his many musical adventures and what makes the Ozarks such a magical and creative place.

ANNOUNCER: Ozarks Public Television and Missouri State University are proud to present "OzarksWatch Video Magazine," a locally produced program committed to increasing the understanding of the richness and complexity of Ozarks culture.

Visit our website for more information.

Welcome to "OzarksWatch Video Magazine."

I'm Dale Moore and I'm really glad you're here.

You know, I've been sitting in this chair for a long time and I always look forward to the next guest, and the next guest, and the next guest.

But this one today, well, this may be about as special as it's gotten in a long, long time.

I'd like for you to welcome on the program today Michael Cochran, author, musician, promoter, a dishwasher, radio personality.

Forest ranger, yeah.

DALE MOORE: Michael Cochran, it's great to have you on the program.

Thank you, Dale.

I'm honored to be here.

We have so much to talk about and so little time to do it in.

So I want to get right to it.

You're not gonna-- you're not gonna believe everything that's going to happen today.

We've got some extraordinary things to talk about.

Let's start with the, first of all, early Michael Cochran, born 1944, West Plains, Missouri.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Yep.

And what did you want to be when you grew up?

Well, starting out, I wanted to be a cowboy, of course, as all kids in the early '50s did.

But when I was 10 years old, 1954, I was sitting on a stool at the soda fountain in the Model Drugstore in West Plains, Missouri, minding my own business.

And there was a little Bakelite AM radio on the back bar.

And suddenly, a sound came out of that radio that I noted.

And it was Chet Atkins playing his recording of "Poor People of Paris."

and I don't know why, but it really grabbed me.

And I said to the soda jerk, who's that?

And he said, that's Chet Atkins.

And I was hooked.

And so I began to seek out Chet Atkins records.

I got a ukulele.

I started to play.

I had two older brothers and I dogged them so much about Chet Atkins that they became Chet Atkins fans too.

And-- So you started playing guitar at a really early age then?

Yes-- Really young.

I did.

I started-- I started playing when I was about 12, late 12 or 13 years old.

DALE MOORE: Yeah, now-- so in those early days, I mean, was there any other musical influences that you liked besides-- MICHAEL COCHRAN: I'll tell you-- --Chet Atkins?

MICHAEL COCHRAN: I'll tell you, Dale.

Elvis hit big in 1956, right?

He did.

He made a little noise in '55, but it was in '56 when he had "Don't be Cruel" and back-- hits in sequence.

The whole world was gaga about Elvis.

I hardly noticed.

I was too busy ruining my posture bending around the guitar, I didn't even hardly notice Elvis.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

Because that's how deeply into Chet-- Chet's guitar playing I was.

And I know that eventually you wound up with-- and like I said, we've got so much to talk about.

I'm trying to get to the-- it's all good stuff, but I really want to get the good stuff.

And you wound up in radio.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Yes.

Working in radio.

Talk-- walk-- walk through that-- your radio experiences.

My junior and senior years of high school, which would have been-- no, actually it was my sophomore and junior years of high school, in 1960 and '61, a friend of mine and I convinced Robert Neathery, the owner of West Plains' only radio station at that time, KWPM, which was a little day timer-- went off the air at 11:00 at night, and we convinced him to let us keep the station on the air another hour on Friday and Saturday nights, so the kids would have something to listen to after 11:00.

So that was my beginning.

We talked our way into this gig, you know.

I have a very similar story.

And I knew Mr. Neathery.

Heck, in those days, everybody knew everybody in West Plains.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

And he gave us a shot.

And at first it was commercial free, but lo and behold, people started wanting to advertise on the show.

So we kept it up.

And then when I came to Mizzou-- went to Mizzou in 1962, I did a little radio work on the student radio station there, and I found that I could do part-- I traveled all over the country for several years, in the wild latter '60s.

And part-time radio was something I was able to latch on to as a part-time job, usually overnights, nothing-- nothing to be particularly proud of.

DALE MOORE: Right.

But that was my radio experience.

And then in 1977, I landed the job of Morning Drive at KFRU in Columbia.

At that time, KFRU was the dominant station in that market.

It was the flagship station for Missouri University football and basketball broadcasts that were fed out statewide from there.

And I got to work for Mahlon Aldridge, one of the real pioneers-- DALE MOORE: A powerhouse.

--of Missouri radio.

Called the play by play for the Tigers for 26 years.

It was a great privilege to get to be real pals with him.

Yeah.

Because doing the morning drive, at 5:00 in the morning when I would get there, it would just be he and I.

And we talked a lot, so that was that.

And now, you graduated from him MU?

You went to MU and graduated from MU?

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Yeah.

And your degree was in?

English, creative writing.

DALE MOORE: OK. English, creative writing, but you liked music and you liked radio.

That's quite an interesting combination.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Yeah, in fact, I never have really used my degree at all.

But I was very happy at KFRU.

And then in 1978, I think it was, my oldest brother, Russ Cochran, put out the first issue of the "West Plains Gazette Magazine," which was a quarterly devoted to the history of West Plains and Howell County.

And it was a big hit.

And so I resigned at KFRU, went to West Plains, bought half interest in the magazine, and took over as managing editor of it.

And did that for several years and did a lot of writing, various interesting stories about the history, and families, and events.

And I'm very-- still to this day very proud of that work.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

Well, that's-- I mean, there's-- everybody watching this program from that area, from Howell County, is very familiar with "The Gazette," so-- MICHAEL COCHRAN: Oh, good.

Yeah, absolutely.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: And one of the big honors we received, we were just hitting our stride with "The Gazette" at the same time that Lynn Murrow, Professor-- DALE MOORE: Russell Keeling-- Keeling-- were putting together "Sassafras"-- DALE MOORE: Yeah.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: --which as you know was a multimedia-- DALE MOORE: Yeah.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: --presentation.

Very analog.

There was no digital.

DALE MOORE: 16 projectors, if I recall.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Yes, multiple screens-- DALE MOORE: Yeah.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: --and-- I'd love to see that again-- DALE MOORE: Yeah.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: --sometime.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: I hope that gets digitized sometime.

But anyhow, they heard about "The Gazette."

And they came down to West Plains and talked to us.

And we wound up being included-- you know, not a big deal, but we were mentioned.

And I was very proud of that and still am.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

Another pivotal thing that happened out of "The Gazette" was I met Chet Atkins in 1960 when I was 16 years old.

My two brothers and I got in the family car and drove to Nashville during Christmas vacation that year and waltzed into RCA Studio B with no preface, and said, we're the Cochran brothers from West Plains and we're here to see Chet.

Can you imagine doing that now?

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Oh, no.

But one we had one thing going for us.

In 1960, Porter Wagoner was one of RCA's biggest stars.

Porter was having a lot of hits, was very popular.

And of course, the first thing Chet asked us was, do you know Porter?

Well, yes, we did, we knew Porter.

So that helped us, you know.

And that's when my relationship with Chet began.

But-- DALE MOORE: So it was a many years relationship with Chet.

Yes, yeah.

Yeah, from 1960 until when he died.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: We sent him copies of "The Gazette" and he read them.

And he loved them because he said it reminded him of his own upbringing in the Clinch Mountain Region of East Tennessee.

And I guess my writing made an impression on him.

Because many years later when we got the idea to do his biography, which was called "Chet Atkins, Me, and My Guitars," the idea was we were going to use his significant guitars that he played throughout his career as milestones along the career path.

And when he learned that I wanted to be the writer of this story, he didn't put up a fight at all.

DALE MOORE: Wow.

He said, yes, I'd be happy for you to do this.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

How long was that collaboration to write the book?

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Two years.

Yeah.

Actually, a little more than two years.

Started in late '98.

There were numerous phone calls with him when he had time, numerous trips to Nashville to photograph his guitars and talk to people who knew him down there.

And actually, it would have gone on longer except that he had a stroke.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

Yeah.

And we lost-- he was still alive, but he could no longer participate in the book.

But that book was published in 2001.

DALE MOORE: Right.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: And he did get to see it.

I'm-- I'm fascinated with how that-- how-- the phone call-- hey, Michael.

Chet.

You want to write a book?

I mean, how did that all transpire.

Well, I want to tell you this, Dale.

Chet was my first hero and he endured.

He never did anything to make me think less of him.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

And I never got over being in awe when I was in his presence.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

Even though we got to where we would tell jokes-- DALE MOORE: Yeah.

--and kid each other, still to-- it kind of made you numb to be with Chet.

DALE MOORE: Yeah, so, it was published, and then there's another notable individual that you-- talk about your relationship with Les Paul.

I wrote-- I wrote the Chet biography and my brother, Russ, published the first edition of it.

It was later republished by a large publishing house.

The book went over-- we didn't know how it was going to go over, but it went over really well, which, of course, we were happy about that.

DALE MOORE: Sure.

And we hadn't really looked beyond doing anything else.

Chet was our hero and we wanted to do this book to honor him.

And we did it.

And got a lot of pats on the back.

But then we thought, well, what else can we do?

Hmm, how about Les Paul.

Only Les Paul.

So, we sent Les a copy of the first edition Chet Atkins book, which people should know-- hardcover, slipcase, signed and numbered only 1,200 copies of that first edition, for $150 apiece, and it sold out.

So we sent that book to Les and asked, would you be interested in having us do a book like this on your career?

And the answer was, well, blank, yes.

You know, Les had a big ego.

Yeah, oh, yeah.

And Also, we met a fellow in Nashville-- his name was Tom Doyle-- who was very close friends with Les and who loved our Chet book.

And he whispered in Les's ear, hey, these guys-- these guys are first rate, don't be afraid to go in with them.

So we went up to Mahwah, New Jersey, where Les lives, and knocked on his door.

And he opened the door and we walked in.

And I must tell you this story.

We walked in and sat down.

And you have to understand, Les was wary.

He had-- he felt that he had been burned many times by journalists.

DALE MOORE: Really?

Yeah.

And he wasn't wrong.

As in not telling his story correctly, or?

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Well, the way he put it was they would interview me and I would give them the answers, and then they would write what they thought.

Reviewers.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Yeah.

So we sit down that first day-- and I've never met Les before.

This-- it was one thing to know Chet for many years before we started that book, but to start with Les Paul, we didn't know him at all.

So we sat down in his living room and he said, where are you boys from?

My brother said, West Plains, Missouri.

And that didn't mean anything to Les.

And I said, I'm from Springfield, Missouri.

And he went, oh, is KWTO still on the air down there?

Wow.

And that-- we had something in common.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

I said, oh, yeah, it's still on the air, still going strong, still one of the dominant stations.

And then he proceeded to tell the story of how he and "Sunny Joe" Woolverton as the Ozark Apple Knockers played on KWTO the day it went on the air.

I believe that was Christmas Day 1933, if I remember correctly.

So we were off and running after that.

But Les was still cautious, but over a period of time we became good friends.

And he knew he could trust me.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

How long did it-- how long were you in production writing that book?

That book, from beginning to publication, took about four years, three and a half to four years.

DALE MOORE: And so, was it his life story?

What-- how-- MICHAEL COCHRAN: Yes, it's his life story.

DALE MOORE: From beginning to end, sort of thing.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Yes, yes.

And his career spans-- his active professional career spanned 75 years.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

Now, I mean it's a daunting task to figure out how you're going to organize this.

Plus, he's an inventor, he's a entertainer, he's a fabulous arranger, and one of the best guitar players that ever came down the road.

DALE MOORE: Right.

All of these things had to be woven together like a tapestry.

It was a huge challenge.

Well, you know, I mean, it's two artists alone that you've already talked about-- I mean, Chet Atkins in his own right, obviously, off the charts, literally.

And then when you-- but when you say the name Les Paul to musicians, there's almost this reverence that overtakes the room-- MICHAEL COCHRAN: Yes.

--when you mention the name Les Paul.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Yes, well, Les revolutionized the recording industry by inventing sound on sound.

We don't have time to start talking about the impact that Les Paul had.

But I will say this, he loved the book.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

Good.

And the way I would get his approval, after I-- I would write sections and I would call him on the phone and read it to him-- DALE MOORE: Really?

--over the phone.

Yeah.

This would usually be at 3:00 in the morning.

DALE MOORE: Wow.

Because he was a night owl.

When we would go to New Jersey to see him, he wouldn't see us until 5:00 in the afternoon.

Because he would be up all night.

He was still working on things.

He still had ideas for inventions.

And when I-- you know, writing-- as a writer, you know this-- writing the ending of any project or a book is important.

And when I wrote the last pages for the Les book, I went to New Jersey.

And we sat in his kitchen and I read it to him.

And he cried.

DALE MOORE: Wow.

And then I cried.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

That's as good as it gets.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Yeah.

I don't know, Michael, how are you doing any better than that.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: I don't think I could.

I think-- and I think I'm the luckiest guy in the world to have gotten to do this.

And as I will tell anyone who listens to this, it's all because of Chet.

DALE MOORE: Yeah, yeah.

Everything I've done with those four major books.

Were-- were Chet and Les Paul-- I guess they were friendly?

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Oh, yeah, they were-- they were very good friends.

They-- they sparred some.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

Earlier in their careers.

Because Chet would tell anybody that his two greatest influences on his guitar playing were Django Reinhardt and Les Paul.

And if you are familiar with the playing of those two greats, and then listen to Chet, you can hear it.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

Les Paul kind of-- he invented what we guitar player is call pull off licks, where you use your left hand to pull off the strings.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

Without using your right hand.

[imitates guitar],, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[imitates guitar].

Yeah.

Well, Chet-- Chet played the pull off licks probably better than Les ever did, but anyway, they were really back in good shape with each other when they made that Chester and Lester album.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

And won a Grammy for it.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

And, yeah, they were good friends.

We don't get away without talking about your other writing, your other books.

The third book was "Hopalong Cassidy, an American Legend," which was the story of William Boyd, the man who played Hoppy, told through the eyes of his widow, Grace Bradley Boyd, a wonderful lady, who was in her 80s when I met her.

And I really think the love story that's told in the Hoppy book would make a good movie.

And my brother, Russ, who was a rather famous art dealer in his own right, numbered among his clients Michael Jackson, George Lucas, Steven Spielberg-- we sent a proposal to Mr Spielberg with along with a copy of the book.

He thought the book was great, but no, he didn't want to do it.

But, anyway-- And then the fourth book was the biography of singer, songwriter Don McLean, famous for having written "American Pie."

DALE MOORE: Absolutely.

And also "Vincent, Starry, Starry Night."

And that book was published, I believe, in 2012.

And by then everyone said, what are you going to do next?

What are you going to do next?

Rest.

We even had the opportunity-- I'm not-- it wasn't a sure thing, but we had the opportunity to do a book with Brian Wilson, the head Beach Boy.

I just-- by then, I had a child and a-- DALE MOORE: Right.

You know, what do I have to prove?

You and I were talking about, before we went on, about the craft of writing, and it's really a lonely endeavor.

I mean, you really are isolated.

It'll make a hermit out of you.

It did me.

To do it-- to do it right, I think.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Well, to do it at all.

Because they don't write themselves, do they, Dale?

DALE MOORE: No, they don't.

What are your memoirs going to look like, you think?

I'm sure you're working on them.

I'm trying-- yeah, I'm trying to figure.

I've had a very adventurous life, Dale.

In the mid to late '60s, I was a hippie.

And-- DALE MOORE: Me too.

Brother.

I'm not at all ashamed of that.

I think there was a lot of naivety in that generation, but we got a lot of things right.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: But anyway, I did a lot of running back and forth across the country.

I worked for the Forest-- United States Forest Service as a remote fire lookout on three different times.

.

DALE MOORE: DJ.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: Oh, yes.

We didn't mention KGBX.

MICHAEL COCHRAN: We did-- You were at KGBX.

KGBX came to KFRU and hired me away from Mahlon, which he wasn't happy about.

Yeah, so that's what caused me to move to Springfield in I think '81, late '81.

DALE MOORE: Right.

And I went on air as afternoon drive and music director at KGBX, a wonderful radio station.

I worked with great people there, great people.

Yeah, you and I worked in an era where-- now we sound like old fogies, but-- MICHAEL COCHRAN: Well, we are-- --when radio-- when radio was King.

And we are a little foggy-- foggy-ish.

Yeah, it was great.

Well, I look forward-- I look forward to your memoirs, because I think you've got stories you need to tell.

You're not through-- you don't-- storytellers don't stop telling stories.

That's right.

And I'm really enjoying having the time to devote to it now, you know.

When you're writing under contract and you have deadlines, you have to say no to almost everything.

People want you to come to the barbecue or-- DALE MOORE: Yeah.

--do this or that, you just can't do it.

Not if you're serious about finishing your work.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

I occasionally ask my guest this question, and I'll ask you.

So if you were going back and you were giving advice to a nine or a ten-year-old Michael Cochran, knowing what you know today, what would you tell Michael Cochran?

I think I would say, Mikey, if you're really great, you won't have to say so.

Do whatever you do and give it your best.

Don't worry about-- don't worry whether or not you're a genius or really if it's even any good, just do it.

DALE MOORE: Yeah.

Do the work.

Yeah yeah.

Well, I knew this was going to be special.

And I want to thank you for taking the time to be on our program today.

This has been super.

Thank you, Dale.

As I said going in, I've watched you host this show since it began and a lot of notable people have sat here.

And I don't know that I'm worthy to be one of them, but I sure am honored that you invited me in.

I'm just tickled you were here.

Thanks a lot.

Thank you, Dale.

You stay tuned.

I'll be right back.

ANNOUNCER: Ozarks Public Television and Missouri State University are proud to present "OzarksWatch Video Magazine," a locally produced program committed to increasing the understanding of the richness and complexity of Ozarks culture.

Visit our website for more information.

I'd like to thank our guest, Michael Cochran, for talking with us today.

And we'll see you again next time on "OzarksWatch Video Magazine."

[music playing]